If you’re a radio advertising professional, I’d really appreciate it if you’d watch this brief (4:58) video and then share your input with me here on the blog.
And no, it’s not a sales pitch.
Thanks,
Dan
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Highly opinionated radio advertising guru and radio talent/morning show coach.
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Sounds extremely intriguing, but my gut is already telling me that member access to information and materials this good will be too rich for my blood! (not that it wouldn’t be worth every penny, but you asked for my feedback)
@ Johnny: This isn’t a trick to get you to commit to a price — I promise I won’t use your words against you as some sort of sly sales technique.
But:
1. What do you think would be a fair price for the monthly membership?
2. What price might be “affordable” (I hate that word) to you?
In fact, I’ll throw that question out to you and anyone else who read this. And it is not a negotiating ploy.
Sounds like a video RAB deal? All I want to have for my clients is a factual way to say “I want to make you more money, and I know how. Here’s what I mean…”
I think this is where this is headed… but frankly cannot tell from the promo piece. It’s rather vague.
I am an owner-operator and get pitches every day from someone who wants some sort of monthly commitment from me but I am more concerned with making my monthly obligations than anything else. So I apply the old motto. If it PAYS it STAYS. This sounds like there’s an up-front cost. The only real question yet to be answered is… not WILL it pay (Pig in the poke) … but DOES it pay!
BTW to answer your “affordable” question? A profit margin of a minimum of 100% more than it costs in hard cold cash on the station’s bottom line.
Cost doesn’t matter as much as RETURN.
Dan, I agree that all this sounds most interesting and something the industry has not been offered, but yet so much needs. Price is a concern for me as well being based in a small market….I pay $175 a month right now for RAB….from my market standpoint, something from that price range up to $250 a month continues to pique our interest rather than us saying “we can’t afford it” Either way, I would certainly like to know more about this
Knowing your reputation and, obviously, reading your newsletters, I am certain that your program would work – especially for us small market guys. You know your stuff.
However – anything with a fee right now is almost impossible – we’re cutting corners where we can and trying our best to do as much as possible with smoke and mirrors. (Translation: Timing is bad. In other words “I’ll advertise with your station when business gets better”. We’ve all heard that one.)
My reps NEED this kind of guru help. I can see the potential in this. Unfortunately, I don’t control the purse strings – I wish I did. Unless you can barter this service, I most likely won’t be able to afford it.
However, I don’t know the price, the “long term” commitment or any other details so my objections may wind up being hogwash.
Send me info – keep me informed and let’s see how good I am at selling “Mr. Owner” on investing in the future of his stations.
Bill Lakatas
@Cal: Re: “affordable”: I wish every radio owner/manager had your attitude.
Sounds like a great service to stations. I too am thinking that in days of really tight budgets.. we probably would not have the money to spend to join it. We are watching pennies in these tough sluggin days.
This is as close to a gift from Heaven as I’ll ever see.
But I will be shocked if I can afford it. My business is smaller than small and I’d give anything for it just to be average — after 28 years of busting your rear you believe it will never happen no matter what you do. Then something like this comes along, something that’s never been done to my knowledge, something that is better than any course offered by any school anywhere. I can’t imagine the amount of work it will take you to put this together and make it work. I have no doubt it will be worth its weight in platinum no matter what the charge, and I know you’ll price it fairly. But I can’t allow myself to hope that I’ll be able to avail myself of it.
But Dan, I’m so glad for the industry that you’re doing it. I’ve been listening to you for a long time; that plus my experience has shown me that if there’s one industry that clients don’t understand, it’s this one. We have all had to listen helplessly as people tell us our business, ask us why they should pay for what they can get for nothing. They don’t question or argue with their doctor, their airline pilot, their gas station mechanic, or the lawn care guy, but they think that anyone can write an ad, and some actually can’t hear the difference between a real commercial and a radio station announcement a la the Bad Commercial Generator, for readers who’ve had the real pleasure of using it. I recall a reader comment, a station rep I believe, who said that his client was overjoyed that here was a program that could write his commercials for him. Again, this is a gift from Heaven.
I’m not in the radio industry, but I am in sales and I call on businesses. I find your ideas to be useful in my business. $39.95 per month would be a good price for me.
@Bill: I think I’ve got the “long term commitment” covered. It’ll be month to month. That keeps the pressure on me to keep producing valuable stuff, and — I hope — it makes it safer for the members.
That’s why the first month you won’t be frontloaded with tons of stuff…while subsequent months are light.
My plan is continually build the resources, month by month.
Hi Dan,
(and the rest of the tribe here.)
Your service is valuable both from a training and inspiration viewpoint. What that value is will vary from person to person and market to market.
Unfortunately, a computer won’t be able to determine if it’s an individual in a 50 watt station in North Dakota or a major market station in Toronto signing up.
However, there might be more volume dollars in pricing the service for individuals improving their own skill set rather than betting stations/companies are going to invest in staff improvement. (those that will are probably already sending their people to your seminars)
For me? $65.00 a year. Cheap but, you asked. (cheap? me? no, frugal.)
As you once told me, everyone’s favorite radio station is WII-FM… What’s In It For Me. I think the beauty of this is that you make it so radio people can get to the heart of what is in it for the advertiser. This has so much to offer, no the least of which is that it is fresh information. I think you may be on to something.
Not a bad idea. What might add to this is if you had written page back up for everyone to download. Take it home and study it at their leisure. I would think a price point of 40 per month would be fair. A lot of what I wanted to say has already been mentioned. Have a good time with this Dan. You always put out great products. OK enough “smoke”…ha ha
Dan:
I am excited about this program. The opportunity for the one on one provides a real resource. $50.00 per month would seem fair to me, not sure that you can afford to do it for that….I await all the details.
@ Philip: You’re right in saying a computer can’t determine the value of this program.
Based upon the feedback I’m getting so far, I think I’m underpricing it. (Well, except for your suggested price…)
To me — this is just my way of thinking, similar to Cal’s — is if my new program enables you to make just one new sale per year, it’ll more than have paid for itself…regardless of your market size.
It will be inexpensive enough for individuals, but I’ve run into so many radio reps and copywriters who follow this formula: If x > 0, then x = too expensive.
To be fair, at least account execs have a clear financial incentive for making such an investment: increased sales = increased commissions. Most copywriters, of course, are paid a straight salary.
So I suspect the copywriters whose stations are too cheap to invest (or don’t see the value) in this and who pay for their own memberships will be the most ambitious ones out there…and the ones who probably soon will move on to greener pastures.
@Tim: Thanks for the encouraging words. You’ve perfectly described the value as I see it. I honestly believe the Industry Insider Advantage reports will be worth the monthly membership dues.
I know that I would have paid just for that info. I might well be pouring more than is necessary into this program — because of an industry mentality of, “Why should I pay for anything??”
And perhaps it goes back to my disc jockey days, when I’d overprepare for every show — knowing I’d rather run out of show time than run out of material.
@Bryan: Do you mean a written transcript of the video? You give me too much credit; that really was a spur of the moment thing.
But when I open this up for membership, believe me: There will be lots & lots of words — every one intended to convince you to fork over every last pe— uh, intended to give you all details you need to make an informed decision.
Hi Dan, a quick question for you – is it just sales – y0ur presentation mentions “producers of” radio material – I’m a writer/producer/station imaging professional, is it going to be useful for me?
The other point that I might raise is that – this training sounds great, and from $50 to $150 a month would be OK – but for how long for – indefinatley? 6 months? 12 month membership?
OK said my piece, now I’ll head back into the booth.
Certainly a nice way of introducing a training element that is needed in our business. I think you would need to put a couple of samples out there for the potential buyer to get an idea of how they could use it. Also, from a timing perspective, budgets are starting to happen….but most will not be approved until after the first of the year, so it might be hard for folks to pull the trigger. I think the subscribers would indeed feel cared for under the special call days and some of the bonus knowing that not everyone is going to get this.
Having a limit so you can have 1:1 feedback and Q & A would be a nice touch from what else is out there.
Also, I would think that folks would want market exclusivity guaranteed if they signed up.
I think your plan looks really great! We’ve paid $500 per month for each salesperson enrolled in Sandler sales training and it really paid off, so I think if people understand the value they’re getting they may be willing to pay more. Perhaps you could try a tiered system with a low monthly cost with limited access all the way up to the ‘top of the line’ package that includes everything. You may get more people enrolled on the lower tiers that don’t take up much of your time but would help pay for the system.
Anyway, I look forward to being part of it.
I’m not a prospect. I’m a marketing/sales consultant. That said: An old guru once told me that no prospect can make a buying decision without price. So, I can’t tell you how useful this would be to me (or a radio manager/sales manager) unless and until I know how much. Every ad, no matter where, must tell the prospect how much (or hint at it strongly) – or else people tend to get a mite tetchy. You are our ad guru – you left out the price. You even left out a hint about the price. Or, if the price was there, I missed it because all the comments were immediately below the video. So I did what anyone would do when distracted – I started reading them instead of giving your video 100% of my attention.
Enough on that. Second: I have so much reading material coming across my desk every day, I can’t possibly read it all, never mind absorb it. The internet, blogs, FB, all of it has stolen hours from every week. I’ve got Tom Taylor, Jerry D., Billboard, Eric, Hennes, Lon, Joel – who’d I miss? As respected as you are, I don’t know that more hours expended on information is what I, or your prospect needs. They need to be making sales calls. At this point I might be considering banning all but the traffic computer from my workplace… ’cause nobody’s getting any work done anymore!
Sorry, but you asked.
I don’t so any production for WZZK because I’m part time, but if I was, I’d be intrigued to look into it. Some of what you’re saying is rather vague but it has to be. The real homework is done on each particular client, finding out as much about them and what they’re good selling points are, and then figuring out how to get the public interested in them. But there are some things in general that you can teach folks that would be invaluable to people like me.
I think the industry insights are a great idea. Now that I’m on the other side of the business (I am now the media buyer for a large medical practice) I really appreciate it when I have an ad rep who knows my industry. There sure don’t seem to be many who “get” healthcare marketing.
Consider though that I’m a rare find in media buying because I’ve sold it, produced it, and programmed it for the better part of two decades. Most buyers are fresh grads with a software program that spits out ratings and they do what it says. Tough to get a feel for a small unrated market if you’ve only got a cold piece of software telling you what to do.
I like the idea. My problem is this: I am a first year salesperson in a very small, highly competitive market and most of the training, etc. I can come across is not real for this marketplace. It all seems to apply to the large markets. Are you going to keep this “real” for everybody or is it aimed at large markets. If it is for my type market I think this sounds dynamite!!! Good Luck!
Dan…we’re doing something tangential to what you’re doing in Canada with a web-based strategic and creative approach to winning new radio business in 268 advertising categories. The lens we use to dissect each product group may be of interest to you, since it cuts to the core of what makes radio advertising work for each advertising category. We’ve had some success in selling this, and would be happy to share triumphs and pitfalls with you. (We’re also not desperately clinging to exclusivity over our ideas…we’re in it for the same reasons you are: to make radio advertising the best it can be.)
@Earl: If you do 100% imaging and no commercial work, I’m sure you’d find the material interesting but it really wouldn’t help improve your imaging work.
Otherwise, despite the way I might have made it sound, it’s not specifically for salespeople. It’s for:
• People who create radio advertising
• People who sell radio advertising
In both cases, it’s from the perspective of “here’s what you need to do to produce measurable, profitable results for the client.”
To some salespeople, that will be boring because they’re looking for a magic pill that gives them more sales with no added effort.
To some writers/producers, that will be boring because they’re looking for clever copy to adapt (or plug & play) for their own clients.
I’m hoping, however, that enough salespeople will be excited to learn how to sell to specific client categories based on their specialized knowledge, not based on tricks. (Oh, by the way: In the process of my researching I’m also uncovering untapped advertising categories I didn’t even realize existed.)
And I’m hoping to attract enough copywriters and producers who will be excited by the prospect of having something to work with beyond the client’s newspaper ad.
How long do you need to be a member? I’m thinking pretty much along the lines, “Until I die.” But in reality, you can cancel at any time. I want enthusiastic members, not trapped customers.
Interesting and needed concept. It sounds like the kind of thing I think the bosses would want for their copywriters/producers, but in my experience, it’s the copywriter/producers that end up buying it so they can do killer work. So, affordable is a must.
But affordable from which standpoint? As an individual, I’d be willing to pay $40/mo for a service like this. If a boss is paying for it, I can see that the price could be higher.
I think it is a GREAT idea!
My only caution to you is… if you put all of the BEST information out in the first three or four months… is there any incentive for them to keep buying the program?
Would they just sign up for six months and have “what they need”
I’m not saying to send out mediocre stuff either. I’m just saying it’s going to be difficult to keep some people when money is tight.
I have had people ask if we would provide ads on barter. There are times that I think that may be better than waiting to get paid by some stations too.
Anyway… I always appreciate your insight. I hope my one eye already sleeping ramblings help. ;o)
@Milt: I’m planning to go one better than putting out a couple of samples. During the 9-day launch, people will be able to sign up for a full 30 days for…Well, let’s just say it’s not 30 days for free but it’s darn close.
With (what I consider to be) a low monthly cost and a “cancel at any time” policy, there’s no practical way to offer market exclusivity.
Actually, you’ve given me an idea. I think there is a way — but it would require a more substantial commitment on the part of the member. Let me work on this a bit….
@Dan: You read my mind. There will be two levels of membership. But even the “expensive” level will be embarrassingly cheap.
Why? Definitely not because I’m so generous. It’s because I want to attract as many members as I’ll need to make it worth my while to keep doing this month after month.
With the price points I’ve set, I’m pretty sure enough people will register during the 9-day launch period. If after all the dust settles I decide at some future date to accept new members and I’m thinking, “Boy, I should have charged more,” I’ll happily charge higher membership fees to new members from that point forward.
For people who sign up during the 9-day launch, however, I’ll honor what I hope will become “the old, cheap” rate for as long as they remain members.
@Kathy: Because I’m not teaching “sales techniques,” the information will apply in all market sizes.
@James: I agree that “the boss” should pay for it.
Let’s hope the boss agrees.
@John: Very perceptive of you. I don’t really have any “best” information to lead with — except, of course, for the 24-module video series. I wouldn’t be surprised if some people do the one-month trial, watch all the videos, gobble up whatever other info is there, and then cancel on me.
If so, I hope it’s because they were disappointed in the quality of my information, not because they deliberately set out to rip me off.
Meanwhile, every new month will have new tools. It’s always important for me to provide content-rich material, so I’m not worried about losing stream. If members are happy at, say, Month 3, they’ll be happy at Month 17.
I love the focus on “what is it that produces a result.” This is very different than “what do I have to do to meet the cost per point.” I like the idea that you’ll help get us “in the door.” Businesses are literally starving for great ideas. But in order to share an idea with them – you must be able to get them to talk to you, meet with you etc. So if you’ve got “secret sauce” in that area… that alone could be worth the price of admission – whatever that is. Depending of course upon whether we can afford it after meeting the cost per point. (Seriously, I’ve bought a bunch of your programs – and have always felt value exceeded cost by a lot. Thank you!)
As a new station owner (Oct/Nov) I would invest in it for my entire team, as well as for new hosts/producers. The challenge, of course, would be integrating it into the price we are charging for our revgen programming. Because we are doing multimedia in addition to social media and Internet talk radio, Spanish language, and A/E programming via 3 distinct channels; it would be important to integrate such a top-level ongoing business intelligence series with the other areas of our business (not just radio). For us, pure radio-only focused packaging and sales is not enough. We need multi-tiered, multi-platform, 360 knowledge.
hi dan, im not in the advertising business, so it wouldnt be any interest to me, but thanks just the same jb
I think you have a great idea. Something very practical and valuable.
sounds great – but need some indication of cost – especially as exchange rates will effect ability to join or not…
Good idea.
WHY?
The industry needs it. Management shakeups, old pros dis-employed, new hires too fresh to know, overall listener populations “there” down, businesses in economic crunch needing action more than noise …. better ad efficiency and effectiveness a must. Perfect sense to provide an in house library plus teaching process to improve industry output and keep the cutting edge in sight.
Employee education is a deductible for necessary knowledges. Self improvement and knowledge are things a person cannot lose or have repossessed. Becoming a better communicator is empowerment to being a better person generally. Basic and sophisticated advertising talents will serve ne well in any industry, no matter what level.
I know everyone’s caught up in the cost, but my concern is the actual substance of The Advantage. I’ve trusted in alot of advice that’s come from being a Dan O’Day subscriber for several years, so I know you’re not blowing smoke.
I’m the owner of a production studio, along with six versatile voices, who’s trying to get past the “gatekeeper” myself in pitching my services directly to radio stations, and touting the return their clients will get if they use them. If I can get to the part where I offer a free ad to show what we can do, everything’s golden, and we’ve landed almost every deal, granted there’s only been a few since I started making calls in the last 60 days or so. But whether to pitch the GM or the sales manager, and WHAT to say are the big things holding me back.
I’m by no means a salesman. I’m a production guy who’s done imaging and commercials for eleven years, so I have a much easier time letting my talent speak for me, rather than me speak for my talent. Any tips or feedback? And would The Advantage help me?
I agree that the video, first made me think RAB. While cutting corners is the phrase that pays now, it is equally important to invest in what brings in the revenue.
Certainly need to know more about the program itself. Sounds interesting and not the ordinary, but hard to tell with the short video.
Agree that price is critical, especially now, but anything too low will not garner the respect a program like this wants to get, and too high will be unaffordable. What is that price? Good question, since I’m not sure who the target audience is for this? Is it the stations, the groups, the individual sales people, small market, medium market, and so on. Each variable gives a different answer to the “price” question.
I am also not sure that this program will work internationally. While, I’m sure a number of elements are “translatable” the undercover stuff, while a key aspect, may or may not have relevance here in Europe, or in the Middle East, or even South America, all markets with considerable private radio ventures.
Hiya Dan,
I agree with a lot of the folks who have already commented that you have a great idea. I’ve read your newsletter for the last couple of years now, so I have a good idea of your savvy. Back in the day, I was a multipurpose jock and I would have loved it if my station had had such a tool. Now, I was watching your body language during the video and found it interesting. Your eyebrows were having a field day. 🙂 At least one of your statements can be met with skepticism – to the effect that some material won’t exist till you discover it. I think I got that right. I haven’t had much sleep and ought to go over that section again, but sleep is whispering its sweet nothings and I’ve been up since 4am having slept only a couple of hours prior to that. One could parry your statement with mayhap you made up the information. Mind you, I’m not saying that. I’m being the Devil’s Advocate here. As there’re not enough concrete mentions of what people will actually get, I’d have to say I’d choose it because of your reputation. For people who don’t know you, you need more info for them to make an informed decision, I think.
I couldn’t afford such a service. I wish I could, but at present, times are worse than tough. But, (waggles finger in the air) what I would do price-wise is to charge a higher price for signing on and then a lower price to continue. More flies with honey, doncha know? Also, I’d provide a sample, a snippet of what people would be getting. It would be a nice little hook, but not give away too much. As for the consulting, you mention membership would be limited, but you don’t say to how many. Ergo, I am wondering how you will be able to make yourself available without being stretched too thin. I figure you have that covered, but it never hurts to mention it.
Best of luck with the endeavor. If you ever want to hire a good Devil’s Advocate, let me know. ;->
Dan,
I’m not even in radio ad sales but I’d love to join up to see things from the other side of the fence. I’ve found that being able to understand other peoples’ view of the elephant tends to make things go more smoothly and gets you invited back for more work. This definitely sounds intriguing!!
~Ember
Dan,
This is kind of like telling you what I think of a car before test-driving it. I’d suggest a gravity well (or marketing funnel, or whatever they’re calling it today). Easy steps to get into the whole plan. A freebie or two to give people a taste. Some appetizers for an incredibly affordable price. Some real meat and potatoes for a solid investment. And dessert for those who commit all the way.
I admire those who dive into the deep end, but I’m more likely to wade in from the shallows.
I will be waiting for more information. You have my attention. Any questions I have, have already been asked.
Sounds interesting, but a little vague…will there be stuff included for the Creative/production team, or just the sales staff?
Make sure you pitch this to GM’s and SM’s because production/creative services people are generally not in a position to pull the trigger on something like this. Especially in today’s station environment.
Hi Dan, interesting concept, and it’s certainly filling a need that has been around for a while. Our sales reps here are so overworked that their copywriting suffers, and I’d love to get them in a place where they’re more concerned about getting results for their clients than making their nut for the stations. However, I have to echo a couple of things from above. 1 – I won’t know if it’s something we can do until we have a price. We’re stripped to the bare bones right now. 2 – We’ve got so much overload that I’m not sure our A/E’s and production personnel can take the time to take advantage of what you’re offering. But I hope you do well with this!
Dan this is absolutely great. I want to be on your list. This is something I was thinking about just recently. What I would love to know is the cost for something like this. Would it be a yearly fee, a quarterly fee. Well looking forward more info and please send me the link to register.
Dan I do certainly think that this is a great idea. I have no negatives on this and it will do well for stuff we want to produce on our radio station as well as for me as I develop small campaigns for my own private clients.
Dan,
Leave it to you to find a useful new wrench in the toolbox.
Your insight and advice are always compelling and right on target. You were the first to open my eyes as a young jock about what good radio really is and most importantly why things work or don’t work.
I can directly credit your advice in seminars (and answers to questions I asked you) to helping my career go from “card reader jock” , to winning “best show”awards , to giving me the confidence to jump into radio syndication. You can count this as a long overdue “thank you” for all you never knew you did for me.
We all need any advantage we can find…especially in this economy. To get that advantage from someone we know, who cares about the end result is rare. If I was selling advertising or shepparding a flock of salespeople I would be chomping at the bit to find out more information. Most of you reading this already know the real secret here…if Dan says he’s on to something..he is!
(no I don’t work for his PR firm..he doesn’t need one!)
Same as it ever was: folks seem to have trouble paying attention to what they want MORE than to what they’re afraid of. You just got both barrels of the Fear Of Cost. (You kinda sked for it, saying “not selling anything,” ha ha, sorry)
It’s a great idea, I think people WANT IT and it’s much needed – especially at this time in the industry. As teased by you in this video, a little more vague than compelling, but certainly leaves me teased and wanting to know more. Also, where you buy your cough syrup.
I have a casebook study for you. Out of the clear blue, I was contacted regarding a new commercial buy (in Modesto, Calif); would I take a look at what the station wrote? Having just loaded up on fresh info at your August Summit in L.A., I asked if I might re-write a bit. Shortened story: I ended up creating a five-spot campaign for a local cabinet shop owner, who was so impressed with the commercials he made a bigger buy, practically doubling it.
My spots only started running this past week. We’ll see how effective they are soon. I’m confident, though, that they are tightly designed for specific responses, aligning first with the listeners’ consciousness, escalating the need and then reassuring in a non-selling manner, all as outlined in your series of classes about five weeks ago.
When you post your examples, samples, Dan-O, I’m sure it will help; call me if I can help with visual aids.
Recently I made a tough money decision. I don’t have any either, particularly embarrassing for a Radio Hall Of Fame nominee. I chose to purchase more education, feeling the need of an all around sharpening of the skills. But had to overcome, not only the MONEY obstacle and the I’m-ALREADY-a-pro angle, but the QUALITY of information hurdle. What pushed me over into a “yes” was the answer to all three. The value is there, thus the direction I crave AND the possibility of being able to use that information to (help) pay for the classes.
Helped me, hope it helps you.
Sounds like it has the potential to be an enormous asset. I agree with a lot of what’s already mentioned by others. Target the individual professional who is motivated to self improve. Price it accordingly, I think (a dangerous concept, I know) that 10 to 20 a month, perhaps with a year commit would be doable for “most” anyone. With pricing like that your bound to get thousands signing up for resources like you mention. You’ll get the payoff in volume.
Thanks again for coming up with a scheme to make me grow and strive to be better.
Just reviewed your video….Sounds like a great idea…Just don’t hurt yourself doing all that research…..Even with the small screen, the flow was good, no hesitation and great audio….I would imagine I could go to your new site and search “Mom and Pop liquor store” and discover specific points related to their business and their location….Like in NC you can not glorify alcohol by using adjectives like “Delicious Bud Lite-6 pack for only 1.99″ The copy would have to read…..” Bud Lite…6 pack…1.99″…From a production stand point I’m sure such trivia would be helpful. NOT saying your service would be trivia—But I’m sure you can see how much time would be saved in re-dos and keeping your customer out of trouble with the local law. Good Luck, Dan…Go for it!
I’m increasingly embarrassed by the caliber and lack of advertising knowledge radio sales people have today. Anything you can do to help them understand what works, and what does not work, when it comes to creating results for their clients, is badly needed. Having said that, I offer my clients a similar service, and as you know, station owners are not lining up to add an expense line to their ledgers! I sincerely wish you success in your project.
Is this going to better for a station to purchase for our manager/sales staff use, or could it be priced low enough that each sales executive with insentive to do well could be a member on their own. I myself would love to have all this info and access to more, but the station , as others have said can not ad to it’s expenses right now. If it was price per individual, like $19.99 month, then those with the craving to move ahead would put that money into it
The idea sounds fantastic. I can only speak for myself, but anything that could get us “production folks” energized about what we do…I’m all for it.
I can only see a few hurdles I would have to overcome to get this project into my budget.
The first, of couse, is the price. I had to cut 2 people from the production department of my station group this year. So the dollars just might not be available…no matter how reasonable the cost.
The bigger issue, at least for those of us in the Clear Channel family, is our company’s Creative Services Group…or CSG. In some ways, the CSG provides similar features of your proposed project. And at no cost to CC stations. And that’s where the “sell to the bosses” would be the hardest.
Now I believe having as many resources as possible is the best route and different perspectives make for better results. And let’s be honest…I think there are many of us in the radio production trenches who are looking for something to help us get re-energized and excited about doing what we do again. I know I have been in a state of creative “ho-hummery” for longer than I care to admit.
So forge ahead with this project. I’ll keep up with what’s going on in the newsletter.
SOUNDS LIKE SOMETHING THAT MY SALES STAFF WILL GET PLENTY OUT OF! AS A COPYWRITER, I AM ALWAYS LOOKING TO IMPROVE MY ART! THINK THIS WOULD BE A GOOD INVESTMENT FOR MY TAMPA RADIO CLUSTER!
Like the others I see this as quite valuable. As a non-commercial station I’ve always had top work through the concepts and try top make them applicable to us. Sadly, it has become too arduous a task considering the many hats I have to wear here.
Would you even consider a non-com wing of your service?
I have been selling radio for 5 years in a satelite market for a small independent radio station. We have two great stations to sell and are in the process of opening a larger station in my market. YEAH. I have my share of obstacles in my quest for success and my schtick is that I am able to write great ads and often produce them myself.
I went through four emotional responses while listening to your blog. First: it’s been done – {names deleted}, who has been trying to do something similar, and who knows who else Second: Yah, but maybe this is different…more like a combination of what everyone else is doing Third: I’m earning less money this year than last year but my cost of living hasn’t adjusted…I really can’t afford to add any more costs to my plate right now. The fourth and most important place where I sit now is that this year in particularly, I need to sharpen my selling skills. I can’t count on great creative when I can’t convince a client to stay on radio during this time, let alone increase his buy! I need new inspiration, new language, new insight. I’m thinking that what you have to offer might just be what I need to get my train back on the rail. The bottom line (price) will have to be managable on an individual basis as there is no way I can convince our company to buy any program no matter how much they will make back. It’s just not our year to invest in anything other than setting up the new station. I’m interested. I better make a payment on my credit card so I can purchase this! Thanks for asking for our input. It’s interesting reading other responses. Good luck!
Love the idea. My take may be a bit different. I think you should price this aggressively and ween out the posers. People who really want to succeed in radio need to put their money where their mouth is. Many industries make their people get certified and pay for extra training in order to keep their job – radio should be the same. Kids who pay for their own college, study more and party less – you need to make this something people VALUE and take seriously. That’s the only way THEY will make it work for their clients. It would also be cool to be part of an exclusive club of real professionals.
my 2 cents.
I think it is a great idea.
Before joining Golden Media in 2007 (a media buying agency) I was with Jones Radio/Broadcast Programming/Broadcast Electronics for 20 years and spent 10 years in local radio before that. I sold consulting, satellite and MOHD syndication, customized formats, equipment, day part shows, software, jingles and just about anything else a station would need.
Without having read all of the posted comments, I have a few quick observations.
It is really tough to get any station or ownership group to pay cash for anything. It was tough in 2007 and I expect even tougher today. Will you have a barter element available? If not, it is easy to hook up with Dial Global or others and make that an option.
I think you will find the most success with enlightened sales people on an individual basis; which means your marketing costs would be greater in order to reach those folks.
It is hard to say how much that service would be worth. It would be hard to say no at $100 per month but I’m sure you need more than that to make it successful.
Here is simple truth I learned in syndication: It takes a lot of clients to make profit. While I am appreciative of the personalized service you’ll provide, I think it will be more difficult to make profit that way. You might consider an “A” and “B” levels of service. When I sold consulting, we figured a consultant was maxed out at 20 clients. So maybe you can carry (X) at the “A” level and (Y) at the “B” level.
I think you are on to something and I wish you luck with it.
Dan, You are so good! We have the (outdated) Quantum Radio series on Video..(that’s how old these “tapes” are!) I know that our small company would not invest in your series but I surely wish that I could! Your insights are spot on!
Great idea, and very timely. We’re launching a full-time station next month, half-commercial, half-community. Not sure what price point you have in mind, but any thoughts on an education rate?
I like your willingness to actually get in your car, go make some sales calls, and get a true reading on what works, what does not work. I’m a psychologist, as well as 45 year pro in radio and done it all. I’ve been a GM, PD, OM, owned my own and own my production company so I can sell my own stuff.
I still do a morning radio show for a company owned by a friend of mine. I have been to {deleted}, and {deleted} seminars and found these guys to be really out of touch. Neither of these guys could possibly make a living in today’s sales resistant environment.
So there are many so called “sales trainers” that spout “body language” and other things that are just not accurate! I’m a psychologist, I’m trained in research design, and there is a lot of just bad psychology out there that programmers are trying to get results with and trying hard, and failing!
So, yes, the idea that you are going to actually go out there and make some calls, is the RIGHT way to do something!
You’re going to find that because of your beard, you are going to miss some sales, people ARE judging you by the way you look. People in the industry know you, respect you, but we are a bizarre bunch. You will soon find that as you get on the street, there is amazing sales resistance. People like myself have some of the answers, but it’s going to be interesting for you and a growth experience as well for you.
I’m excited about your project! You’ll learn a lot and you’ll grow your knowledge base immensely!
I love your stuff…you’re a little “out there” sometimes as to the “real world” but I like you.
Dan,
The key thing I would look for is one or two key, tangible elements each month I can use and implement in a timely manner (ie. simple and effective techniques for reaching medical clients). I know the advice will be sound and usable because that is what you’ve been providing for years; h0wever, it needs to be spot on, focused and tangible.
Price: If I’m paying for my own individual membership, $19.95-$39.95. If it’s a station/group membership, $100-$150.
@Roger: Thanks for the encouragement.
By the way, for those of you who’ve heard me play the excellent “AMS Mortgage” commercials at one of my seminars — Roger’s the guy who created it. (In 5 minutes, no less.)
@Tim: No, it doesn’t sound as though this will address the problem you describe. You’re talking about an aspect of sales training; my entire focus will be on creating effective radio advertising. That does include, at times, telling you what to say to get the attention of a prospect in a particular niche…But it’s not sales training.
But the good news for you is I do have exactly what you need: How To Get Past The Gatekeeper.
@Mark: All of the radio advertising principles I teach are applied successfully around the world. The success stories I’ve already uploaded include one from Australia (okay, English-speaking) and one from The Netherlands (not English-speaking).
I’ve personally taught these radio advertising principles in 36 different countries. They work around the world because no matter where you are on the globe, radio works the same and the human brain works the same.
There are cultural differences that color the ways in which these principles are applied. But the principles are universal.
Ironically, the one thing that occasionally might not transfer well to different cultures is the feature I consider the most valuable: My Industry Insider Reports. I’m sure some advertising categories apply only — or mostly — in North America.
But everything else — the training videos, case studies, radio advertising principles, etc. — applies internationally.
@Becky: So, you think I’m already sitting on a pile of material that already exists? Interesting.
One could parry your statement with mayhap you made up the information. That will be very easy to test: Digest the information and then use it when you talk to a client or prospect in that particular industry.
If they say, “Huh? What are you talking about?” then maybe I made it all up.
If they say, “How did you know that??” then perhaps I actually did the research.
I am wondering how you will be able to make yourself available without being stretched too thin. Believe me, I’ve given that a lot of thought. That’s why I’m opening membership registration for just 9 days (starting September 21) and then closing it. The plan is then to keep the membership closed until/unless enough people cancel to assure me I can handle more.
Obviously, I’m hoping that doesn’t happen — that, in fact, no one cancels.
@Robin: My Radio Advertising Advantage is for both sales and “creative.”
The idea is to give you valuable tools you can use to create effective radio advertising campaigns for your clients.
There won’t be any “production tricks” or techniques, though. It’ll be all about the message. If someone is purely a producer and never gets involved in the writing of the campaign or crafting of the message, that person probably wouldn’t find it useful enough.
@Daya: It’ll be a monthly subscription, which you can cancel at any time.
Your point about developing campaigns for your own private clients is a good one. I’m pricing this so even a one-person shop can afford it.
@Rich: Thank you for your kind words. Your check is in the mail.
@Bill: Problem is, I can’t handle thousands of members. So it’s a delicate balance of charging enough to make it worth my while but not too much for enough people to afford.
At the moment — I know some people will say this sounds like hype — based on the feedback I’m getting here I think I’ve priced it too low.
I guess I’ll know for sure come Monday….
Don: I think the RAB has a search feature like that for its members, and they certainly have a large archive of information.
I expect to add just one new Industry Insider Report per month. Not because I’m sitting on a stash of them but rather because they require a lot of time to research and produce.
So three years from now, you’ll have 36 industries for which you can search. But each one will be presented from a viewpoint you’ve never seen before.
@Diane: I’m expecting (guessing?) most members will be stations, not individuals. It will be priced so that a truly ambitious account exec or creative director can afford it.
If the station doesn’t subscribe, that account exec should because the information will result in increased sales & commissions.
But the creative director probably doesn’t receive any commission, so…
Still, I’m sure some creative directors and copywriters will join simply because they’re very ambitious.
@Joe: I guarantee the tools I provide aren’t in the CSG. (Unless they’ve stolen some of my materials! Alert! Alert!) (Just joking, guys. I’m not accusing anyone of anything.)
Frankly, I don’t think you can “sell” this to “the bosses.” Either they’ll think, “Great idea, great value, great price, let’s do it” or they’ll think, “Eh, no.”
@Coy: If your non-com targets specific advertising categories for its sponsorships, maybe this will be worth the money to you. But it really is all about radio advertising.
Adding a non-com version? If my Radio Advertising Advantage is as successful as I think it will be, I won’t have any free time to launch an off-brand version.
And if it flops? If no one is interested, no one signs up? If it turns out to be the Heaven’s Gate of radio advertising initiatives?
Well….Probably not then, either.
@Theresa: For new inspiration, insight and language to sharpen your selling skills, order this book now: The Ultimate Sales Machine, by Chet Holmes.
Or download this radio-centric teleseminar I did with Chet.
I personally vouch for it. If you’re a salesperson, it’ll change your life.
@Jon: Okay, so I’ll charge, say, $20,000 per month and attract only that exclusive group. And I can put you down as “definitely”?
Actually, I understand what you’re suggesting. And if I could figure out the exact price that would
A) Limit membership to a select few
and
B) Produce the financial reward I need to keep this project going…
…That’s exactly what I’d do.
In lieu of that, however, I hope you’ll still consider joining.
@Dennis: A very intelligent suggestion, but I’m not interested in doing barter. I want only people/businesses that value what I’m offering enough to pay for it.
As my friend Chet Holmes (see my plug for his book and teleseminar above) says, “If they don’t pay, they don’t pay attention.”
I want my Radio Advertising Advantage members to be active participants…who pay attention.
I agree that “enlightened sales people” are good prospects for this venture. I can think of several whom I’m certain will sign up. But I’ll be pleasantly surprised if enough of them join to sustain it without stations joining, too.
An “A” level and a “B” level? Hmm…. “Watch the skies…”
@Fred: For my “education rate,” I’m planning to charge double. Sound good to you?
(Just a joke. Fred’s British; he can take it.)
No, I don’t plan to offer a discounted rate. But I believe your station will be able to afford it.
@Ralph: Oops, I won’t be getting in my car and making sales calls.
I’ll be toiling away in my secret underground laboratory, concocting exotic new formulas for you to use when you’re out there on the street.
@Les: Your first paragraph perfectly describes what I’m attempting to do.
And after members have digested the training videos, I hope they, too, will consider “one or two key, tangible elements they can implement each month” to be the hallmark of a successful membership.
I think most people believe that …the problem that I think you’ll run into is… people don’t believe that they have the (going to steal from Chet) “pig headed discipline” to actually use the product the way they know they should.
It’s like people who buy the crappy treadmills…they know they’re not going to use it…they want to feel good about buying it and don’t want to feel bad about buying something they don’t use…so they buy a crappy cheap one.
I love the idea and can’t wait to see it.
I think your venture is a great idea for those enlightened companies who have managers that VALUE information and continuing education for their staff.
If they don’t have the time or the small amount of money that it would cost them for valuable sales/creative/communication ideas, they get salespeople that go out unarmed amidst an arsenal of competition. I always wanted more info when I was working at a radio station, but the company was either too cheap, or didn’t have a CLUE as to what I did to get spots on the air as a Creative Services/Production Director.
I hope you do well with this…. the sound of radio in general would improve if there was better information out there about the advertisers. I always did research a client when I wrote spots, and still do when I write copy. How can you do a spot without knowing what you’re talking about? And how can you even sell it to begin with? There’s no such thing as too much information when you talk about serving a client….and everyone at the radio station is in the “serving the client” business!
Best of luck in your new venture. I think if you can find the owners/managers that “get it”, you’ll do well.
Wow Dan!
This sounds amazing. I can really see huge benefits especially for someone like me who is really still a novice on the sales side of radio.
However I must confess the cost does concern me. I am a very small business and don’t have very deep pockets yet. I can see how something like this would pay for itself quickly, but the cash to get started is a worry.
The two things that have most excited about this are the in depth case studies and the opportunity to have private consultations with you. Any body who doesn’t take advantage of that is a fool.
How many people are going to able to join?
@Deborah: I think you’ll find the required “cash to get started” to be within your range.
I do have a limit number on the maximum number of people who can join, but for now I’m keeping that private. We’ll really need to have the program underway for me to evaluate what the ultimate maximum number should be.
That’s why I’ll be taking registrations for only the last 10 days of this month. At that point, no more new members. If a few months later I think we can handle more, at that time I might reopen it to new members.
Always so great of you to give back to the industry. Your campaign sounds superb! As a jock and VO talent..please teach those AE’s that ‘less is more’ in that copywriting!The simple formula: humans speak 3 words per second.Therefore a :30=90 words and a :60 = 180 words….when there’s 200 words, we only sound like screaming car salesmen ads…..Now go get ’em Dan!
Your lighting needs to be more even. Sound is good. Background is pretty blown out, highlights-wise.
Dan,
This sounds almost too good. And I think of the ole saying ” if it sounds to goo, it is!” With that being said I wish you luck. I think that it takes money to make money but with all the cutbacks, I would need to SEE proof before I commit to spending ANY money. And even if A company could cut somewhere else I think it would almost need to be a guarantee or risk free etc… I am not a owner so what do I know?
Just my two cents..
@Rick: I hope I’m pricing it so that instead of saying “it sounds too good to be true,” people will say, “What a great bargain!”
But you guys will be the judge of that.
As far as “risk free,” I think I’ve devised a plan that enables any serious pro to “test drive” this new venture virtually without risk.
Thanks for your post. Your concept is interesting and there seems to be a needed demand for presenting Radio Air Advertising to the SMB space in todays recession driven economy.
Customers are looking for a way to sharpen the bottom lines of the balance sheets. I would welcome fresh ideas in this economy and new strategies to a clearer path through the receptionist “aka” the gatekeeper as well as relationship development ideas that can streamline my projections for targeted revenue over the next 12 months or so; and certainly anyone who has existed in this economy for the last two and a half years should feel the same.
Let ‘s get on that growth highway to recovery and invest our energies in a winning strategy to renew our careers in advertising.
As far as cost. You pay for what you get. For me, although my finances maybe not what they once were, I would pay a quality coach and mentor a flat fee and a percentage of my earnings on a sliding scale from 5% – 15% or 20%. If I am making 7 figures then 20% is a write off anyway. That’s the goal right 7 figures?
sounds excellent. if i was in charge i’d have you come to oz to do stuff with the station but im not and they couldnt afford it because we are community station. but professional people working there.
Bob Sherman did a sales seminar wherein he advocated “The Guarantee;” some sort of assurance or insurance to an advertiser that a flight would work. How about offering the same to your clients?
@Bill: I absolutely believe in what Jay Abraham refers to as “risk reversal.”
I’ve devised a way in which you can experience my Radio Advertising Advantage for 30 days for…well, almost nothing.
While I can’t guarantee any individual’s results — some people will digest the information but do nothing with it — this does remove the risk so you can see for yourself.